1 00:00:22,359 --> 00:00:09,080 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 2 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:25,429 hello and welcome to the skeptics own 3 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:29,610 podcast episode number 409 for the 21st 4 00:00:35,450 --> 00:00:33,090 of august 2016 Heidi Robertson here 5 00:00:39,610 --> 00:00:35,460 filling in for Richard Saunders who's 6 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:39,620 not feeling so crash hot today I'm sorry 7 00:00:45,770 --> 00:00:42,690 coming up more from the Brisbane skeptic 8 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:45,780 camp and an interview with Enric a who 9 00:00:50,899 --> 00:00:47,370 talks about the real dunning-kruger 10 00:00:53,869 --> 00:00:50,909 effect no not Brian Dunning from the 11 00:00:56,210 --> 00:00:53,879 sceptile cast this is the effect where 12 00:00:59,270 --> 00:00:56,220 unskilled people tend to overestimate 13 00:01:02,299 --> 00:00:59,280 their abilities it's not as many people 14 00:01:06,020 --> 00:01:02,309 think people who are too stupid to know 15 00:01:08,420 --> 00:01:06,030 how stupid they are after that we join 16 00:01:10,940 --> 00:01:08,430 Maynard and Richard at the Australian 17 00:01:12,580 --> 00:01:10,950 Museum in Sydney as they get ready to 18 00:01:15,020 --> 00:01:12,590 perform the mystery investigators 19 00:01:18,859 --> 00:01:15,030 science show as part of the ongoing 20 00:01:22,100 --> 00:01:18,869 science week outreach program may not 21 00:01:24,859 --> 00:01:22,110 also chats with Katherine be hag who is 22 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:24,869 the manager of the festival and visits 23 00:01:30,289 --> 00:01:27,090 the booth of the university of 24 00:01:34,370 --> 00:01:30,299 technology to find out about extreme 25 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:34,380 magnification with Alison this report 26 00:01:41,330 --> 00:01:36,329 will be of particular interest to 27 00:01:44,989 --> 00:01:41,340 teachers but now it's time for me to run 28 00:01:48,399 --> 00:01:44,999 to the kitchen and make my kids some 29 00:01:52,340 --> 00:01:48,409 lunch I think they have requested 30 00:02:15,360 --> 00:01:52,350 toasted cheese sandwiches while I do 31 00:02:29,020 --> 00:02:19,330 it's the raw skeptic report with Heidi 32 00:02:30,190 --> 00:02:29,030 Robertson okay who've we got here what 33 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:30,200 are you doing at skeptic aunt what's 34 00:02:36,490 --> 00:02:32,690 your name my name is Enrico Bustamante I 35 00:02:39,670 --> 00:02:36,500 did a short presentation on the actual 36 00:02:42,190 --> 00:02:39,680 dunning-kruger effect and comparative 37 00:02:44,770 --> 00:02:42,200 comparing it to what people tend to 38 00:02:47,530 --> 00:02:44,780 think it is okay so first of all tell us 39 00:02:49,570 --> 00:02:47,540 what your experience has been that what 40 00:02:52,330 --> 00:02:49,580 do people generally think the definition 41 00:02:54,820 --> 00:02:52,340 of the dunning-kruger effect is that the 42 00:02:56,590 --> 00:02:54,830 that people that are too stupid to know 43 00:02:58,360 --> 00:02:56,600 that they're stupid cannot tell that 44 00:03:00,640 --> 00:02:58,370 they are stupid now tell us the correct 45 00:03:02,289 --> 00:03:00,650 meaning of the dunning-kruger effect off 46 00:03:05,770 --> 00:03:02,299 the top of my head the nearest I can 47 00:03:09,030 --> 00:03:05,780 come up with is that those who are 48 00:03:12,210 --> 00:03:09,040 relatively unskilled in a specific thing 49 00:03:14,620 --> 00:03:12,220 tend to suffer illusory superiority 50 00:03:16,060 --> 00:03:14,630 regarding their ability in that 51 00:03:19,539 --> 00:03:16,070 particular thing that is being brought 52 00:03:22,930 --> 00:03:19,549 into question okay so you think the the 53 00:03:24,430 --> 00:03:22,940 whole definition that most people think 54 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:24,440 that the dunning-kruger effect is that 55 00:03:29,620 --> 00:03:26,570 the people are too stupid to know that 56 00:03:32,259 --> 00:03:29,630 they're stupid is is too simplistic as 57 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:32,269 was North most things yes it's also very 58 00:03:38,170 --> 00:03:35,810 catchy and sexy for the media and when 59 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:38,180 you think about if you say well they're 60 00:03:44,319 --> 00:03:39,850 too stupid to know that they're stupid 61 00:03:46,690 --> 00:03:44,329 it also reinforces the whole a positive 62 00:03:49,900 --> 00:03:46,700 message for me they are not as good as I 63 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:49,910 am so it's more it's a lot catchier it's 64 00:03:53,740 --> 00:03:52,130 not as complicated and you don't have to 65 00:03:55,750 --> 00:03:53,750 think about it too much which is why I 66 00:03:58,020 --> 00:03:55,760 tends to kind of be a good meme that 67 00:04:00,550 --> 00:03:58,030 latches on to people and spreads and 68 00:04:02,979 --> 00:04:00,560 sadly it doesn't give us the real 69 00:04:04,449 --> 00:04:02,989 picture of what tends to happen with 70 00:04:06,449 --> 00:04:04,459 people and that has nothing to do with 71 00:04:09,759 --> 00:04:06,459 intelligence just skill and experience 72 00:04:11,860 --> 00:04:09,769 can you tell us a bit of the history of 73 00:04:16,390 --> 00:04:11,870 whoo Dunning and Kruger were and how 74 00:04:17,110 --> 00:04:16,400 that phrase came about not much I do 75 00:04:19,890 --> 00:04:17,120 know that we 76 00:04:23,620 --> 00:04:19,900 the paper that they submitted in 1998 77 00:04:26,740 --> 00:04:23,630 David Dunning was a research 78 00:04:28,780 --> 00:04:26,750 psychologist if i recall correctly and I 79 00:04:31,629 --> 00:04:28,790 forget his name mr. Krueger was his 80 00:04:33,790 --> 00:04:31,639 undergrad student who his research 81 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:33,800 student under him and they did a study 82 00:04:38,650 --> 00:04:35,210 which they looked at several different 83 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:38,660 things including humor and something 84 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:41,210 more concrete which was grammar and they 85 00:04:46,150 --> 00:04:43,970 had look at how people measured how good 86 00:04:48,909 --> 00:04:46,160 they thought they were how well they 87 00:04:51,820 --> 00:04:48,919 tested and how well they thought they 88 00:04:53,740 --> 00:04:51,830 did at the test and the lower half 89 00:04:56,230 --> 00:04:53,750 especially the lower quarter of people 90 00:04:57,879 --> 00:04:56,240 thought they were quite good and that 91 00:05:01,379 --> 00:04:57,889 they did quite well on the test when in 92 00:05:03,580 --> 00:05:01,389 reality their results were appalling 93 00:05:07,050 --> 00:05:03,590 very interesting because you do see it a 94 00:05:11,379 --> 00:05:07,060 lot that phrase in skeptic circles and 95 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:11,389 it's interesting to have heard your your 96 00:05:15,340 --> 00:05:13,610 own experiences regarding the 97 00:05:17,439 --> 00:05:15,350 dunning-kruger effect that you spoke of 98 00:05:20,219 --> 00:05:17,449 in your talk yesterday can you take us 99 00:05:23,260 --> 00:05:20,229 through that when you first began work 100 00:05:24,909 --> 00:05:23,270 yes but it was during a practical 101 00:05:28,750 --> 00:05:24,919 experience during my university studies 102 00:05:31,390 --> 00:05:28,760 as a teacher I went to a school that is 103 00:05:34,270 --> 00:05:31,400 not particularly low socio-economic but 104 00:05:38,020 --> 00:05:34,280 as far as student behavior is concerned 105 00:05:40,330 --> 00:05:38,030 is quite rough and I was given to a 106 00:05:42,870 --> 00:05:40,340 mentor teacher who was one of the best 107 00:05:46,719 --> 00:05:42,880 in the school at behavior management and 108 00:05:48,909 --> 00:05:46,729 thus she had the rougher classes and I 109 00:05:52,330 --> 00:05:48,919 went in thinking I can do this I'm going 110 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:52,340 to be perfectly fine I I am a genius i 111 00:05:56,890 --> 00:05:54,770 can manage its no problem and i almost 112 00:06:00,580 --> 00:05:56,900 felt my practical because of that at one 113 00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:00,590 point leaving the school i had the 114 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:02,330 thought to myself i have no bleeping 115 00:06:05,980 --> 00:06:04,370 clue what I'm doing because i honestly 116 00:06:10,300 --> 00:06:05,990 didn't i did not have the necessary 117 00:06:11,740 --> 00:06:10,310 experience or knowledge to do what I 118 00:06:13,180 --> 00:06:11,750 needed to do in that classroom and keep 119 00:06:15,700 --> 00:06:13,190 the students from killing each other or 120 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:15,710 myself but that takes a quite a lot of 121 00:06:22,750 --> 00:06:18,770 insight into yourself to to realize that 122 00:06:25,750 --> 00:06:22,760 and and then to take steps to to fix it 123 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:25,760 so to speak wouldn't you say it does 124 00:06:30,100 --> 00:06:27,770 take a lot it is quite possible to go 125 00:06:31,030 --> 00:06:30,110 into a spiral of self-doubt where you 126 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:31,040 think 127 00:06:36,460 --> 00:06:33,890 do I know enough am i deluding myself 128 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:36,470 into thinking I'm better than I am am i 129 00:06:40,780 --> 00:06:38,090 deluding myself into thinking I'm not 130 00:06:42,130 --> 00:06:40,790 good enough and you kind of have to work 131 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:42,140 your way out of it I haven't actually 132 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:43,970 read the research on that particular 133 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:45,530 side of things but it is something that 134 00:06:49,990 --> 00:06:47,570 can happen but you do need to be able to 135 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:50,000 look at yourself and think do I need to 136 00:06:54,340 --> 00:06:52,730 go to someone who knows better yeah 137 00:06:56,140 --> 00:06:54,350 definitely and I think that's a big part 138 00:06:59,400 --> 00:06:56,150 of what skepticism is isn't it it's 139 00:07:02,110 --> 00:06:59,410 recognizing that you don't know 140 00:07:04,660 --> 00:07:02,120 everything and also referring to the 141 00:07:08,020 --> 00:07:04,670 professionals in their field because 142 00:07:12,130 --> 00:07:08,030 that is their area of expertise exactly 143 00:07:14,710 --> 00:07:12,140 especially and that's why I wanted to do 144 00:07:17,110 --> 00:07:14,720 make do my talk he is simplifying it to 145 00:07:19,420 --> 00:07:17,120 their that the stupid the stupid are too 146 00:07:22,890 --> 00:07:19,430 stupid to know that they're stupid takes 147 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:22,900 away from the actual meaning of it words 148 00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:26,570 you have this space to learn you need to 149 00:07:31,540 --> 00:07:29,330 be able to identify when you need to go 150 00:07:33,310 --> 00:07:31,550 and get help when when you should say I 151 00:07:34,900 --> 00:07:33,320 don't know I don't know enough to ask 152 00:07:35,980 --> 00:07:34,910 the right question I don't know enough 153 00:07:40,150 --> 00:07:35,990 to actually be able to do this correctly 154 00:07:42,450 --> 00:07:40,160 and simplifying it to it being about 155 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:42,460 intelligence doesn't help either because 156 00:07:48,730 --> 00:07:45,290 intelligence is not a quantifiable thing 157 00:07:50,290 --> 00:07:48,740 and so that that whole experience that 158 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:50,300 you had in the classroom that you 159 00:07:58,090 --> 00:07:55,130 described yesterday it did seem to be 160 00:08:00,910 --> 00:07:58,100 quite traumatic for you but also it kind 161 00:08:03,910 --> 00:08:00,920 of it appeared to be an epiphany for you 162 00:08:07,810 --> 00:08:03,920 in a way as well so what did you do in 163 00:08:11,470 --> 00:08:07,820 order to to learn what you had to do to 164 00:08:14,370 --> 00:08:11,480 get a classroom under control I learned 165 00:08:19,420 --> 00:08:14,380 to listen a lot more than I used to I 166 00:08:21,430 --> 00:08:19,430 went from thinking of everything as a 167 00:08:23,770 --> 00:08:21,440 suggestion to actually listening to 168 00:08:28,570 --> 00:08:23,780 expert advice and considering it expert 169 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:28,580 advice and not simply arguing but trying 170 00:08:33,010 --> 00:08:31,370 to frame any argument as to why should I 171 00:08:34,270 --> 00:08:33,020 do this thing this way why should I 172 00:08:37,659 --> 00:08:34,280 consider it in the way you are telling 173 00:08:40,659 --> 00:08:37,669 me to can you maybe asking for 174 00:08:42,219 --> 00:08:40,669 clarification on the reasons for the 175 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:42,229 expert advice and suggestions if I 176 00:08:47,140 --> 00:08:44,450 didn't understand why 177 00:08:49,060 --> 00:08:47,150 and also going it to a point where I am 178 00:08:51,910 --> 00:08:49,070 much more comfortable now admitting to 179 00:08:55,510 --> 00:08:51,920 myself I don't know enough there is more 180 00:08:58,930 --> 00:08:55,520 to learn and not skipping on anything 181 00:09:02,920 --> 00:08:58,940 someone who might know more than I will 182 00:09:05,110 --> 00:09:02,930 say and just as far as my own experience 183 00:09:07,690 --> 00:09:05,120 goes with people I i tend to respect 184 00:09:10,780 --> 00:09:07,700 people much more if they are able to 185 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:10,790 take that step back and say I I don't 186 00:09:16,180 --> 00:09:13,370 know instead of making something up or 187 00:09:18,670 --> 00:09:16,190 pretending that they do know everything 188 00:09:21,340 --> 00:09:18,680 even if it is in their own area of 189 00:09:25,810 --> 00:09:21,350 expertise there's always something that 190 00:09:28,690 --> 00:09:25,820 you don't know very much so and sadly as 191 00:09:31,420 --> 00:09:28,700 Cassandra pointed out yesterday it can 192 00:09:33,340 --> 00:09:31,430 be a matter of ego some people aren't 193 00:09:35,110 --> 00:09:33,350 resilient enough or haven't trained 194 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:35,120 themselves to be resilient enough to be 195 00:09:38,590 --> 00:09:36,890 able to take that hit or to their ego 196 00:09:41,100 --> 00:09:38,600 and admit in front of someone else or 197 00:09:44,020 --> 00:09:41,110 even to themselves now I don't know in 198 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:44,030 whatever form that's going to take it 199 00:09:52,660 --> 00:09:47,770 takes a level of maturity do you think 200 00:09:53,950 --> 00:09:52,670 maturity yes and a lot of the tools that 201 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:53,960 we skeptics use a lot of the 202 00:09:58,300 --> 00:09:55,850 metacognitive tools about being able to 203 00:10:01,480 --> 00:09:58,310 think and about how we think and process 204 00:10:04,870 --> 00:10:01,490 the information that we have well it was 205 00:10:07,270 --> 00:10:04,880 a very very good talk yesterday and 206 00:10:09,220 --> 00:10:07,280 thank you for your time on the skeptic 207 00:10:11,410 --> 00:10:09,230 zone I hope to see what more skeptics 208 00:10:16,590 --> 00:10:11,420 events in the future was my pleasure and 209 00:10:23,439 --> 00:10:20,489 hello everyone Heidi Robertson here 210 00:10:28,150 --> 00:10:23,449 every single day in the United States 211 00:10:31,269 --> 00:10:28,160 alone 22 ex servicemen and women take 212 00:10:34,569 --> 00:10:31,279 their own lives you may have seen a 213 00:10:38,189 --> 00:10:34,579 social media campaign found on twitter 214 00:10:40,989 --> 00:10:38,199 with the hashtag 22 push up challenge 215 00:10:44,289 --> 00:10:40,999 the idea is to raise awareness of the 216 00:10:47,979 --> 00:10:44,299 impact of PTSD post-traumatic stress 217 00:10:52,049 --> 00:10:47,989 disorder and suicide of the troops by 218 00:10:55,329 --> 00:10:52,059 during 22 push-ups every day for 22 days 219 00:11:00,009 --> 00:10:55,339 filming yourself and uploading it to 220 00:11:02,259 --> 00:11:00,019 social media each of those 22 days the 221 00:11:05,979 --> 00:11:02,269 idea is to nominate someone else to take 222 00:11:09,340 --> 00:11:05,989 up the challenge currently I'm at day 10 223 00:11:12,249 --> 00:11:09,350 of my 22 day challenge and feeling 224 00:11:14,109 --> 00:11:12,259 pretty saw a minor complaint compared 225 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:14,119 with the pain and anguish of our 226 00:11:22,259 --> 00:11:18,290 veterans and their families today as I 227 00:11:25,769 --> 00:11:22,269 record on the 18th of August 2016 is 228 00:11:28,929 --> 00:11:25,779 Vietnam veterans day in Australia 229 00:11:32,499 --> 00:11:28,939 Australia had 60,000 troops in the 230 00:11:36,609 --> 00:11:32,509 Vietnam War and like the USA our rates 231 00:11:39,129 --> 00:11:36,619 of PTSD depression anxiety and suicide 232 00:11:45,189 --> 00:11:39,139 in our troops wherever they served are 233 00:11:47,139 --> 00:11:45,199 too high since 1999 49 Australian 234 00:11:52,090 --> 00:11:47,149 soldiers have been killed whilst on 235 00:11:57,159 --> 00:11:52,100 active duty while 239 have taken their 236 00:11:59,139 --> 00:11:57,169 own lives so if you can't manage full 237 00:12:01,269 --> 00:11:59,149 push-ups try them on your knees or 238 00:12:04,989 --> 00:12:01,279 standing and doing them against the 239 00:12:08,429 --> 00:12:04,999 kitchen bench alternatively many people 240 00:12:11,109 --> 00:12:08,439 are instead donating $22 to 241 00:12:14,829 --> 00:12:11,119 organizations assisting veterans in 242 00:12:17,109 --> 00:12:14,839 various ways if none of those options 243 00:12:19,779 --> 00:12:17,119 are viable you can always raise 244 00:12:22,389 --> 00:12:19,789 awareness by simply talking about it and 245 00:12:25,779 --> 00:12:22,399 reaching out to someone who may be 246 00:12:28,419 --> 00:12:25,789 having mental health difficulties there 247 00:12:29,079 --> 00:12:28,429 is help out there if you are struggling 248 00:12:31,569 --> 00:12:29,089 yourself 249 00:12:45,239 --> 00:12:31,579 please don't give up seek some help 250 00:12:49,989 --> 00:12:47,499 we've just opened the quirkology 251 00:12:53,590 --> 00:12:49,999 exhibition at Edinburgh Smew ziam of 252 00:12:55,989 --> 00:12:53,600 childhood you can shrink in size see the 253 00:12:59,019 --> 00:12:55,999 amazing cylinders two squares illusion 254 00:13:04,150 --> 00:12:59,029 live watch all your favorite college 255 00:13:05,860 --> 00:13:04,160 Eclipse create your own illusions we 256 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:05,870 never tasted by magician David 257 00:13:10,540 --> 00:13:08,689 Copperfield and lots more we can take 258 00:13:12,879 --> 00:13:10,550 the exhibition anywhere so if your 259 00:13:15,460 --> 00:13:12,889 Museum science center shopping mall or 260 00:13:24,900 --> 00:13:15,470 school get in touch for more information 261 00:13:32,630 --> 00:13:30,100 here's my not spooky action at the 262 00:13:37,170 --> 00:13:34,830 well as you know it's science wig 263 00:13:38,790 --> 00:13:37,180 Science Week all over this city people 264 00:13:40,050 --> 00:13:38,800 are going wild people going crazy people 265 00:13:42,030 --> 00:13:40,060 just going out there and getting that 266 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:42,040 PhD as quickly as they possibly again 267 00:13:46,290 --> 00:13:44,410 i'm here at catherine at the australian 268 00:13:48,750 --> 00:13:46,300 museum wrap it at the top level now 269 00:13:51,450 --> 00:13:48,760 which is quite palatial having a coffee 270 00:13:52,830 --> 00:13:51,460 but you actually you've got a science 271 00:13:55,140 --> 00:13:52,840 festival t-shirt on so you know what's 272 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:55,150 going on I sure do so I manage the 273 00:13:59,480 --> 00:13:56,890 Australian Museum science festival here 274 00:14:03,210 --> 00:13:59,490 in Sydney at the host Raleigh Museum and 275 00:14:04,890 --> 00:14:03,220 it's been a very fun week and I'm 276 00:14:07,380 --> 00:14:04,900 looking forward to next week where we've 277 00:14:09,090 --> 00:14:07,390 got all the high school kids coming it's 278 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:09,100 been very busy here so what have we got 279 00:14:12,630 --> 00:14:11,050 happening today we're doing a show for 280 00:14:14,820 --> 00:14:12,640 some kids are they primary school or 281 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:14,830 high school so this week has been all 282 00:14:18,390 --> 00:14:16,450 the primary school we've already seen 283 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:18,400 about 3,000 primary school kids come 284 00:14:22,530 --> 00:14:20,650 through the door another yelling that is 285 00:14:25,020 --> 00:14:22,540 a lot of yelling it's a lot of 286 00:14:28,500 --> 00:14:25,030 excitement so we have live animals so 287 00:14:32,310 --> 00:14:28,510 the kids get to meet Frank the 20 288 00:14:35,010 --> 00:14:32,320 frogmouth they get to hold lizards and a 289 00:14:37,590 --> 00:14:35,020 big snake which scares a few kids to 290 00:14:39,510 --> 00:14:37,600 have you got a Gibbon no don't have to 291 00:14:42,210 --> 00:14:39,520 give it the eight the apes are not 292 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:42,220 represented I wouldn't say that aches 293 00:14:46,500 --> 00:14:45,490 are not represented that's true and look 294 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:46,510 at the kids been a bit difficult 295 00:14:53,430 --> 00:14:49,330 sometimes kids can pull or push or hide 296 00:14:55,590 --> 00:14:53,440 the turtle no the kids have been really 297 00:14:58,590 --> 00:14:55,600 great it helps that the teachers are 298 00:15:00,690 --> 00:14:58,600 there with the kids but they've just 299 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:00,700 been fantastic they've just really 300 00:15:04,950 --> 00:15:03,490 enjoyed every single workshop and every 301 00:15:07,290 --> 00:15:04,960 single show that they've attended today 302 00:15:08,910 --> 00:15:07,300 and catherine has someone who's seen a 303 00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:08,920 few things going on what do they seem to 304 00:15:13,140 --> 00:15:10,930 be the most interested in what's the one 305 00:15:17,010 --> 00:15:13,150 thing the kids go oh they're really up 306 00:15:19,740 --> 00:15:17,020 for it well one of my favorites is a the 307 00:15:22,590 --> 00:15:19,750 forensic science workshop so the stem 308 00:15:25,170 --> 00:15:22,600 reactor not the stem reactor and we've 309 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:25,180 got another CSI our workshop which is 310 00:15:30,570 --> 00:15:28,210 run by some astronomers am educators and 311 00:15:33,030 --> 00:15:30,580 the kids get to dress up in a suit so 312 00:15:35,430 --> 00:15:33,040 they get to put on the same equipment 313 00:15:38,570 --> 00:15:35,440 that forensic police use and when they 314 00:15:41,430 --> 00:15:38,580 enter a crime scene and I get to do DNA 315 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:41,440 fingerprinting which is great they also 316 00:15:45,750 --> 00:15:43,570 so they work in groups and there's a 317 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:45,760 team leader there's a fingerprint expert 318 00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:48,250 there's a material expert and they get 319 00:15:51,510 --> 00:15:49,690 to work together to try and solve a 320 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:51,520 crime so it's a very immersive and 321 00:15:54,030 --> 00:15:52,690 that's the whole thing about the Science 322 00:15:57,750 --> 00:15:54,040 Festival it's a very immersive 323 00:15:59,850 --> 00:15:57,760 experience for the kids to engage with a 324 00:16:03,330 --> 00:15:59,860 whole range of different science so this 325 00:16:05,220 --> 00:16:03,340 is forensic science but we've got every 326 00:16:07,830 --> 00:16:05,230 other science as well which is here 327 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:07,840 today so physics and chemistry and I'm 328 00:16:11,850 --> 00:16:09,850 happened have you got a PhD have you 329 00:16:14,610 --> 00:16:11,860 been to uni or less or thing I have been 330 00:16:16,500 --> 00:16:14,620 to uni I haven't I got a PhD though what 331 00:16:18,660 --> 00:16:16,510 are you working on so when I went to 332 00:16:21,330 --> 00:16:18,670 university I do the science 333 00:16:26,780 --> 00:16:21,340 communications degree and it's like 334 00:16:29,070 --> 00:16:26,790 ology degree oh ok so dad will me um 335 00:16:31,590 --> 00:16:29,080 narcissist you're looking at me you're 336 00:16:33,990 --> 00:16:31,600 thinking narcissist or sociopath what 337 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:34,000 are you thinking here I wouldn't want to 338 00:16:39,570 --> 00:16:36,970 disclose on radio yes yep she can't tell 339 00:16:41,340 --> 00:16:39,580 you she knows she just can't tell you um 340 00:16:42,750 --> 00:16:41,350 so does it make it actually having that 341 00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:42,760 the critters that make it difficult when 342 00:16:48,060 --> 00:16:44,560 you meet people because you go on psych 343 00:16:52,620 --> 00:16:48,070 101 Europe mmm I mean everybody's in the 344 00:16:56,730 --> 00:16:52,630 DSM even you are in the dsm-5 that is 345 00:16:59,310 --> 00:16:56,740 Jay um I think we've a psychology degree 346 00:17:03,330 --> 00:16:59,320 it's you do get a greater understanding 347 00:17:04,950 --> 00:17:03,340 and I use a lot of what I've learnt for 348 00:17:08,100 --> 00:17:04,960 this fester for it for instance because 349 00:17:10,710 --> 00:17:08,110 we I did child development so I know 350 00:17:12,690 --> 00:17:10,720 what stage the children are at all so 351 00:17:14,340 --> 00:17:12,700 what type of learning styles we should 352 00:17:16,050 --> 00:17:14,350 be using for the different types of kids 353 00:17:18,330 --> 00:17:16,060 so they're showing museum we're all 354 00:17:22,580 --> 00:17:18,340 about informal learning and immersive 355 00:17:24,490 --> 00:17:22,590 learning and we treat every individual 356 00:17:26,530 --> 00:17:24,500 differently okay 357 00:17:27,970 --> 00:17:26,540 what do you thinks the next step here 358 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:27,980 for the museum is there something you'd 359 00:17:32,350 --> 00:17:30,410 like to see them do here for the next 360 00:17:35,050 --> 00:17:32,360 step for Science Week next year's or 361 00:17:37,090 --> 00:17:35,060 something yeah we should do that funny 362 00:17:40,510 --> 00:17:37,100 you mention that and there is that's 363 00:17:44,370 --> 00:17:40,520 alive I mean at the moment ya been so 364 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:44,380 good um but there is a lot of potential 365 00:17:51,100 --> 00:17:47,810 of including even more workshops and 366 00:17:54,370 --> 00:17:51,110 shows we do have over three but actually 367 00:17:56,680 --> 00:17:54,380 I 405 different workshops over the two 368 00:17:59,650 --> 00:17:56,690 weeks and we have 50 organizations 369 00:18:01,960 --> 00:17:59,660 coming from all over Australia 370 00:18:03,790 --> 00:18:01,970 presenting which is fantastic but what I 371 00:18:06,120 --> 00:18:03,800 would personally like to see you next 372 00:18:08,950 --> 00:18:06,130 year is having some more international 373 00:18:10,030 --> 00:18:08,960 collaborations so yesterday I met up 374 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:10,040 with the director of the New Zealand 375 00:18:15,010 --> 00:18:12,850 Science Festival and we're talking about 376 00:18:17,230 --> 00:18:15,020 us being part of their festival and 377 00:18:19,450 --> 00:18:17,240 having some indigenous science because 378 00:18:21,340 --> 00:18:19,460 one of our big focus is here over the 379 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:21,350 two weeks is indigenous science and 380 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:23,930 having their Maori science educators 381 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:26,450 coming and giving a different cultural 382 00:18:31,300 --> 00:18:28,250 aspect of their science that they use in 383 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:31,310 New Zealand and there's so many other 384 00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:33,730 partnerships and collaborations that I 385 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:37,370 would love to investigate for next year 386 00:18:40,750 --> 00:18:39,410 you can learn from everyone no matter 387 00:18:43,300 --> 00:18:40,760 what you know where they're from 388 00:18:44,230 --> 00:18:43,310 everybody has a story and you can well 389 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:44,240 that's what that's what it's all about 390 00:18:48,460 --> 00:18:46,490 this week here really so we're going to 391 00:18:51,190 --> 00:18:48,470 be confronting some primary school 392 00:18:52,810 --> 00:18:51,200 students down there mo yes we have a lot 393 00:18:54,490 --> 00:18:52,820 of primary school kids and that's 394 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:54,500 important teachers to corral them there 395 00:18:58,810 --> 00:18:57,410 we do have some teachers the good thing 396 00:19:01,060 --> 00:18:58,820 and back listener this is a good thing 397 00:19:03,010 --> 00:19:01,070 when promise cool kids come in it's a 398 00:19:03,820 --> 00:19:03,020 bit different to when high school kids 399 00:19:05,650 --> 00:19:03,830 come in because I've noticed 400 00:19:07,780 --> 00:19:05,660 particularly if it's a private girls 401 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:07,790 school from year 11 or year 12 there 402 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:09,530 like a bit oh I don't want to appear 403 00:19:15,730 --> 00:19:11,810 uncool but Primus cool kids they're like 404 00:19:17,950 --> 00:19:15,740 oh I want to talk exactly I that's why I 405 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:17,960 really loved looking after the primary 406 00:19:23,260 --> 00:19:21,410 school kids but even those though the 407 00:19:25,420 --> 00:19:23,270 year 11 and 12 they look like they're 408 00:19:26,860 --> 00:19:25,430 not having fun even their in their 409 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:26,870 cliques I don't want to appear uncool 410 00:19:31,660 --> 00:19:29,210 they don't want to be article but I've 411 00:19:33,940 --> 00:19:31,670 talked to quite a lot after workshop so 412 00:19:35,830 --> 00:19:33,950 I because I came from a science teaching 413 00:19:36,780 --> 00:19:35,840 background so i was doing shows all 414 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:36,790 around Australia 415 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:38,530 around Scotland all around England for a 416 00:19:43,260 --> 00:19:41,530 while and so what I've found specially 417 00:19:46,020 --> 00:19:43,270 teaching and I love teaching the high 418 00:19:47,970 --> 00:19:46,030 school students because you do all these 419 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:47,980 things and you get Blake faces because 420 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:48,970 they don't want to show that they're 421 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:50,890 really excited they talked to them after 422 00:19:55,230 --> 00:19:53,290 wouldn't like wow that was amazing we 423 00:19:57,300 --> 00:19:55,240 want to be a scientist like you we want 424 00:20:00,420 --> 00:19:57,310 to get more involved what can we study 425 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:00,430 to do whatever particular science that I 426 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:03,490 was teaching that day and so even though 427 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:05,650 they don't emotionally show it because 428 00:20:14,490 --> 00:20:09,610 they want to be cool yeah I gave a been 429 00:20:17,310 --> 00:20:14,500 cool years ago frankly no point I I 430 00:20:20,430 --> 00:20:17,320 think they know you're still in there 431 00:20:22,020 --> 00:20:20,440 you're doing fine but I gave up yeah so 432 00:20:25,290 --> 00:20:22,030 what I would recommend to the listeners 433 00:20:27,930 --> 00:20:25,300 is a thank you keep that in a child keep 434 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:27,940 learning keep experiencing and living 435 00:20:33,030 --> 00:20:31,050 life to the fullest we're here at the 436 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:33,040 Australian Museum we're just waiting to 437 00:20:36,630 --> 00:20:34,450 go in and do the mystery investigators 438 00:20:39,180 --> 00:20:36,640 show it's a primary school crowd would 439 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:39,190 be working to today mr. Saunders primary 440 00:20:45,750 --> 00:20:43,050 school age groups that's something like 441 00:20:47,820 --> 00:20:45,760 ten eight and eleven twelve eleven 442 00:20:49,380 --> 00:20:47,830 twelve thirteen year old kids are you 443 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:49,390 know but they will have a teacher with 444 00:20:52,830 --> 00:20:51,490 them and the thing is that if you're 445 00:20:56,580 --> 00:20:52,840 saying something just say really loudly 446 00:20:58,770 --> 00:20:56,590 and they believe you that's true and 447 00:21:00,480 --> 00:20:58,780 I've said to you today that you can have 448 00:21:02,660 --> 00:21:00,490 it up a bit more not that you ever ham 449 00:21:05,460 --> 00:21:02,670 it up and use your trombone yep using 450 00:21:07,740 --> 00:21:05,470 cardboard is an element obviously stuff 451 00:21:10,140 --> 00:21:07,750 like that there's hydrogen and cardboard 452 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:10,150 and obviously hydrogen in cardboard you 453 00:21:13,020 --> 00:21:11,410 say it loud like that they believe you 454 00:21:14,790 --> 00:21:13,030 don't know what they all say what's an 455 00:21:16,260 --> 00:21:14,800 element I'm very disappointed there's a 456 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:16,270 few animals that you can play with here 457 00:21:19,860 --> 00:21:17,770 in the museum but as I have mentioned 458 00:21:22,140 --> 00:21:19,870 book there's no Gibbons there's no given 459 00:21:24,330 --> 00:21:22,150 to play with at the Australian is in 460 00:21:26,490 --> 00:21:24,340 we're sitting under the skeleton of a 461 00:21:27,470 --> 00:21:26,500 giant whale or all whales a pretty big I 462 00:21:29,860 --> 00:21:27,480 suppose hell 463 00:21:34,010 --> 00:21:29,870 and over your shoulder there there's a 464 00:21:36,260 --> 00:21:34,020 buffalo and a bear and an armadillo well 465 00:21:37,820 --> 00:21:36,270 and I see our doors open here so we get 466 00:21:40,610 --> 00:21:37,830 we'd better get our bed of nails ready 467 00:21:42,770 --> 00:21:40,620 our door is open but all the kids from 468 00:21:44,690 --> 00:21:42,780 the previous show or the show just 469 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:44,700 finish haven't streamed out yet but 470 00:21:49,100 --> 00:21:46,050 there are a lot of kids running around 471 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:49,110 the hall here that's true yelling 472 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:52,770 Buffalo Wow see I thought it was just a 473 00:21:57,380 --> 00:21:54,930 nena cherry song but there it is Buffalo 474 00:21:59,810 --> 00:21:57,390 now that the previous kids are now 475 00:22:01,460 --> 00:21:59,820 streaming out of the Hofstra theater so 476 00:22:03,230 --> 00:22:01,470 in about two minutes we'll be able to go 477 00:22:07,700 --> 00:22:03,240 in set up the mission investigators and 478 00:22:09,860 --> 00:22:07,710 we'll take it from there we've just done 479 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:09,870 the first mystery investigators show of 480 00:22:13,130 --> 00:22:11,610 the day we're just waiting for the 481 00:22:15,470 --> 00:22:13,140 second one to come in how do you think 482 00:22:18,620 --> 00:22:15,480 we first show and Richard my mic is on 483 00:22:20,750 --> 00:22:18,630 so my price is ok well I can I can just 484 00:22:22,750 --> 00:22:20,760 tell you it went well it went very well 485 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:22,760 when well it's ok I won't turn my mic 486 00:22:28,100 --> 00:22:25,290 yeah it was a big audience and they were 487 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:28,110 really well behaved a group of boys in 488 00:22:32,090 --> 00:22:29,850 fact you and if I get to be confused 489 00:22:33,620 --> 00:22:32,100 when they picked the water even if they 490 00:22:35,450 --> 00:22:33,630 have three goes at it went on pixel 491 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:35,460 water they know it does work oddly 492 00:22:48,590 --> 00:22:46,790 I'll have a go and you can display 493 00:22:50,090 --> 00:22:48,600 what's happening okay now it looks like 494 00:22:51,860 --> 00:22:50,100 you're doing some sort of fractal thing 495 00:22:53,390 --> 00:22:51,870 here Richard what are you doing I'm 496 00:22:56,060 --> 00:22:53,400 looking how it looks like you're shaving 497 00:22:57,830 --> 00:22:56,070 of the mouse that's that's a very 498 00:23:02,690 --> 00:22:57,840 extreme closeup of my face well you 499 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:02,700 right oh so we can do that and then 500 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:04,410 imagine that we've got all sorts of skin 501 00:23:08,510 --> 00:23:05,970 cancers this is that this keep you 502 00:23:10,910 --> 00:23:08,520 amused all afternoon that's one way to 503 00:23:12,980 --> 00:23:10,920 save me oh that that's what I'd do 504 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:12,990 immediately I would use that and go yeah 505 00:23:17,980 --> 00:23:15,330 I'm gonna die there's my palm print you 506 00:23:20,150 --> 00:23:17,990 see so what we have here is we've got a 507 00:23:22,610 --> 00:23:20,160 magnifying device set up to a computer 508 00:23:24,260 --> 00:23:22,620 and pressed against my skin with some 509 00:23:27,290 --> 00:23:24,270 lights and we can see an extreme 510 00:23:29,420 --> 00:23:27,300 close-up of the pores of my skin yeah 511 00:23:34,100 --> 00:23:29,430 and for the listener it's best described 512 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:34,110 as there well come on I mean I don't 513 00:23:37,300 --> 00:23:35,730 think anyone's skin up that close is 514 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:37,310 going to be a portrait of porcelain 515 00:23:42,830 --> 00:23:39,690 let's look at my watch look at that time 516 00:23:44,540 --> 00:23:42,840 sticking by Wow yet also yeah that's 517 00:23:46,310 --> 00:23:44,550 true yeah when you do look at that it 518 00:23:47,870 --> 00:23:46,320 just goes to explain why shouldn't spend 519 00:23:52,100 --> 00:23:47,880 so much on watches because any what's 520 00:23:54,140 --> 00:23:52,110 even that close looks crappy look I'll 521 00:23:55,610 --> 00:23:54,150 actually talk to someone who has talked 522 00:23:58,970 --> 00:23:55,620 to somebody knows yes I believe this 523 00:24:01,040 --> 00:23:58,980 person has been to a particular place 524 00:24:03,050 --> 00:24:01,050 for more than a day like I did who we 525 00:24:05,060 --> 00:24:03,060 got him where you from my name is 526 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:05,070 Allison from the university of 527 00:24:08,780 --> 00:24:07,290 technology sydney sorry my voice is a 528 00:24:09,710 --> 00:24:08,790 little bit quirky that's okay cause 529 00:24:11,990 --> 00:24:09,720 you've been talking to people about 530 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:12,000 science all day today and what you've 531 00:24:15,860 --> 00:24:13,890 been hoping to educate them with with 532 00:24:18,230 --> 00:24:15,870 the magnifying on the computer screen 533 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:18,240 there just to show them that under the 534 00:24:22,730 --> 00:24:20,250 microscope the whole world completely 535 00:24:24,060 --> 00:24:22,740 changes oh yeah when it comes to one 536 00:24:26,220 --> 00:24:24,070 perspective 537 00:24:28,020 --> 00:24:26,230 the the microscope is completely 538 00:24:29,490 --> 00:24:28,030 different one and that your whole 539 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:29,500 perspective on things can completely 540 00:24:34,140 --> 00:24:32,410 change and what you normally think of 541 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:34,150 something can be completely different to 542 00:24:39,060 --> 00:24:36,730 what you initially had thought and so a 543 00:24:40,260 --> 00:24:39,070 blue circle may be completely different 544 00:24:42,090 --> 00:24:40,270 under the microscope and that is 545 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:42,100 different pigments of different colors 546 00:24:45,930 --> 00:24:44,410 making that blew that's quite a good 547 00:24:48,090 --> 00:24:45,940 scientific lesson to make and of course 548 00:24:49,890 --> 00:24:48,100 even compared to when people talk about 549 00:24:52,830 --> 00:24:49,900 quantum stuff this is still a major 550 00:24:56,430 --> 00:24:52,840 macrovision yeah yeah so it's definitely 551 00:24:57,660 --> 00:24:56,440 not the strongest of magnification but 552 00:24:59,160 --> 00:24:57,670 it does give a little bit more of an 553 00:25:01,260 --> 00:24:59,170 insight to kids who want to know more 554 00:25:03,210 --> 00:25:01,270 about it what do they normally see most 555 00:25:04,590 --> 00:25:03,220 surprised about is that they put it on 556 00:25:05,730 --> 00:25:04,600 their face or their fingerprint or what 557 00:25:07,380 --> 00:25:05,740 do they normally look and they go I 558 00:25:09,300 --> 00:25:07,390 would not change what seems to be 559 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:09,310 blowing their mind today it's definitely 560 00:25:13,890 --> 00:25:11,650 skin because when we look at different 561 00:25:17,490 --> 00:25:13,900 people's skin it just looks quite smooth 562 00:25:19,110 --> 00:25:17,500 and just quite normal but under the 563 00:25:22,110 --> 00:25:19,120 microscope there's definitely definitely 564 00:25:24,630 --> 00:25:22,120 all these different cracks and pigments 565 00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:24,640 of colors some people like to look at 566 00:25:29,310 --> 00:25:26,890 their freckles and little bumps and it 567 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:29,320 just looks so strange and out of this 568 00:25:33,660 --> 00:25:31,930 world sometimes you look but for a major 569 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:33,670 hypochondriac like me like i said i 570 00:25:36,570 --> 00:25:35,050 think i could use those be going oh yeah 571 00:25:38,220 --> 00:25:36,580 that's a cancer that's a gantlet that's 572 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:38,230 cancer that's that pimples gonna kill me 573 00:25:42,210 --> 00:25:40,450 all that's all stuff you know some 574 00:25:45,660 --> 00:25:42,220 people look at bombs and think oh my god 575 00:25:47,100 --> 00:25:45,670 what is that and lots of courses have 576 00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:47,110 you been talking about the people might 577 00:25:50,190 --> 00:25:48,460 be interested at UTS could you have 578 00:25:51,390 --> 00:25:50,200 quite a range of courses there for 579 00:25:53,190 --> 00:25:51,400 someone who wants to get into energy 580 00:25:54,690 --> 00:25:53,200 sciences because what's your favorite 581 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:54,700 you'd obviously have been playing a 582 00:25:58,680 --> 00:25:56,410 favorite here wouldn't you yes so I've 583 00:26:00,870 --> 00:25:58,690 done medical science so the biologies 584 00:26:02,580 --> 00:26:00,880 are definitely my favorite but out of 585 00:26:05,270 --> 00:26:02,590 the things that we have in our stand we 586 00:26:09,630 --> 00:26:05,280 have different examples of physics maths 587 00:26:12,050 --> 00:26:09,640 biology and so all the people have come 588 00:26:15,660 --> 00:26:12,060 here we've definitely be talking about 589 00:26:17,790 --> 00:26:15,670 the medical sciences applied physics and 590 00:26:19,410 --> 00:26:17,800 chemistry okay and here on the skeptic 591 00:26:21,300 --> 00:26:19,420 zone I do like to ask people what took 592 00:26:22,980 --> 00:26:21,310 them down there tertiary education track 593 00:26:24,570 --> 00:26:22,990 what why did you get interested in 594 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:24,580 biology why didn't you go into something 595 00:26:27,270 --> 00:26:26,290 a bit more static like geology or 596 00:26:29,670 --> 00:26:27,280 something like that 597 00:26:31,830 --> 00:26:29,680 well when I got into it I just realized 598 00:26:34,110 --> 00:26:31,840 I love learning about the human body and 599 00:26:36,030 --> 00:26:34,120 just how our body works it's something 600 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:36,040 we normally take for granted how we work 601 00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:38,650 how we breathe how we eat and when we 602 00:26:42,990 --> 00:26:41,050 know more about it we begin to 603 00:26:45,330 --> 00:26:43,000 appreciate a lot more of our bodies and 604 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:45,340 just how we take care of it what's the 605 00:26:49,350 --> 00:26:47,530 thing that fascinates you most about the 606 00:26:50,820 --> 00:26:49,360 human body in the way it does itself is 607 00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:50,830 it there is that the reproduction 608 00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:53,170 digestion is a particular area where go 609 00:26:59,370 --> 00:26:57,090 that's amazing to be up to be honest um 610 00:27:01,440 --> 00:26:59,380 everything about it because the whole 611 00:27:03,420 --> 00:27:01,450 body works in unison you learn of the 612 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:03,430 different systems but then you realize 613 00:27:08,370 --> 00:27:06,250 that one thing isn't depend on 614 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:08,380 independent of each other they all work 615 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:11,410 together and without one of them another 616 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:14,170 doesn't work and so it becomes this very 617 00:27:19,740 --> 00:27:17,530 complete thing that sometimes looks 618 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:19,750 really fliegel but also really resilient 619 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:22,570 at the same time I don't think a lot of 620 00:27:29,090 --> 00:27:25,930 people realize just how easy it is for 621 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:29,100 our bodies to stop working but also how 622 00:27:33,570 --> 00:27:31,210 amazing the body look at the first place 623 00:27:35,790 --> 00:27:33,580 yeah it's just like the things that 624 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:35,800 happen in our body that makes things why 625 00:27:40,890 --> 00:27:38,530 is this incredible it's the word 626 00:27:42,450 --> 00:27:40,900 symbiosis away to explain everything 627 00:27:44,850 --> 00:27:42,460 works in rhythm or is that a bad example 628 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:44,860 no notice precisely how it works just 629 00:27:49,380 --> 00:27:46,930 from the different systems to the 630 00:27:51,170 --> 00:27:49,390 different cells to the different even 631 00:27:53,550 --> 00:27:51,180 the back to how the bacteria of 632 00:27:55,530 --> 00:27:53,560 functions to help our body and sometimes 633 00:27:57,690 --> 00:27:55,540 hurt us yeah because we just can't go 634 00:27:59,550 --> 00:27:57,700 around the whole stack of bacteria most 635 00:28:01,320 --> 00:27:59,560 of it as harmless to us isn't it exactly 636 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:01,330 so some would say that we're more 637 00:28:05,550 --> 00:28:03,490 bacteria than human given that we have a 638 00:28:07,500 --> 00:28:05,560 lot more bacteria but people who like 639 00:28:08,910 --> 00:28:07,510 bacteria say that I think you'd find 640 00:28:10,770 --> 00:28:08,920 that it's people who work in the 641 00:28:12,900 --> 00:28:10,780 bacterial sciences they always say and 642 00:28:14,250 --> 00:28:12,910 stuff like that I mean I think viruses 643 00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:14,260 like you know no one ever has a good 644 00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:15,970 word for them but the bacteria people 645 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:18,610 they're always push in that bacteria 646 00:28:23,710 --> 00:28:19,970 definitely has 647 00:28:25,180 --> 00:28:23,720 a good side to our story but of course 648 00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:25,190 they definitely have a bad side but I 649 00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:28,490 didn't think viruses have will play a 650 00:28:34,300 --> 00:28:31,090 particularly good role in our daily life 651 00:28:35,770 --> 00:28:34,310 compared to bacteria anyway look look so 652 00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:35,780 have a kind word for bacteria 653 00:28:38,710 --> 00:28:37,130 occasionally people lift your game on 654 00:28:39,940 --> 00:28:38,720 that department thanks a lot for 655 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:39,950 chatting to us and where can we find out 656 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:41,930 more about UTS online or more of the 657 00:28:44,860 --> 00:28:43,370 courses and that sort of thing if you're 658 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:44,870 thinking well maybe I might do some 659 00:28:51,340 --> 00:28:49,130 science in my life so at the moment the 660 00:28:53,590 --> 00:28:51,350 beers sort of help would probably be a 661 00:28:56,260 --> 00:28:53,600 UTS open day which is on August 662 00:28:58,570 --> 00:28:56,270 twenty-ninth I think and that way 663 00:29:01,420 --> 00:28:58,580 everyone can come into the university 664 00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:01,430 and check out firsthand the courses and 665 00:29:07,540 --> 00:29:04,490 academics that are available there and 666 00:29:10,900 --> 00:29:07,550 what's your website UTS calm day you 667 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:10,910 that's it yeah it's very easy and if not 668 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:13,250 just go to google and click utes and 669 00:29:17,260 --> 00:29:14,810 protect and particularly the course that 670 00:29:19,060 --> 00:29:17,270 you want to do it's very easy or if you 671 00:29:20,530 --> 00:29:19,070 come to the University you can get a 672 00:29:21,700 --> 00:29:20,540 core staff from right have a good day 673 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:21,710 here I'll let you get back to your 674 00:29:48,049 --> 00:29:23,570 magnifying glass and scaring people bye 675 00:29:54,690 --> 00:29:52,019 dr. Harriet hall md known to thousands 676 00:29:56,940 --> 00:29:54,700 as the skeptic a retired family 677 00:30:00,060 --> 00:29:56,950 physician and former Air Force flight 678 00:30:01,379 --> 00:30:00,070 surgeon she writes about medicine so 679 00:30:04,980 --> 00:30:01,389 called complementary and alternative 680 00:30:08,310 --> 00:30:04,990 medicine science hackery and critical 681 00:30:10,590 --> 00:30:08,320 thinking Harriet now has a free course a 682 00:30:13,639 --> 00:30:10,600 series of ten video lectures on science 683 00:30:16,379 --> 00:30:13,649 based medicine and alternative medicine 684 00:30:18,629 --> 00:30:16,389 the videos and an accompanying course 685 00:30:22,740 --> 00:30:18,639 guide can be found by following the link 686 00:30:26,759 --> 00:30:22,750 at skeptic info or by visiting web 687 00:30:31,110 --> 00:30:26,769 Randy's org slash educational dash 688 00:30:34,230 --> 00:30:31,120 modules dot HTML topics covered in the 689 00:30:37,340 --> 00:30:34,240 series are science-based medicine vs. 690 00:30:40,759 --> 00:30:37,350 evidence-based medicine what is cam 691 00:30:43,950 --> 00:30:40,769 chiropractic acupuncture homeopathy 692 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:43,960 naturopathy and herbal medicine energy 693 00:30:49,230 --> 00:30:46,090 medicine miscellaneous alternatives 694 00:30:52,549 --> 00:30:49,240 pitfalls in research and science-based 695 00:30:55,289 --> 00:30:52,559 medicine in the media and politics 696 00:30:57,840 --> 00:30:55,299 Harriet covers each topic in a matter of 697 00:31:22,640 --> 00:30:57,850 fact no-nonsense way that shorter 698 00:31:28,110 --> 00:31:25,020 thank you for listening to the skeptic 699 00:31:30,299 --> 00:31:28,120 zone get well soon Richard I do hope 700 00:31:33,090 --> 00:31:30,309 you're skeptical kittens are looking 701 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:33,100 after you I don't have any skeptical 702 00:31:41,430 --> 00:31:36,010 cats I'm afraid just a rather credulous 703 00:31:45,210 --> 00:31:41,440 dog who nevertheless says hello and I 704 00:31:47,250 --> 00:31:45,220 must apologize for probably making you 705 00:31:49,860 --> 00:31:47,260 feel a bit nor nauseated this morning 706 00:31:52,350 --> 00:31:49,870 Richard when I told you I was standing 707 00:31:55,770 --> 00:31:52,360 in the pharmacy looking at homeopathic 708 00:32:01,200 --> 00:31:55,780 teething gel for babies and rows and 709 00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:01,210 rows of ear candles yep still on the 710 00:32:07,190 --> 00:32:05,410 shelves but for this week this is highly 711 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:07,200 robertson from the Northern Rivers 712 00:32:12,270 --> 00:32:10,090 vaccination supporters signing off from 713 00:32:19,110 --> 00:32:12,280 the beautiful northern rivers of New 714 00:32:21,630 --> 00:32:19,120 South Wales you've been listening to the 715 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:21,640 skeptics own podcast visit our website 716 00:32:28,740 --> 00:32:25,450 at wwc a petting zoo TV for contacts an 717 00:32:31,890 --> 00:32:28,750 archive of all episodes since 2008 and 718 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:31,900 our online store please support the 719 00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:33,970 skeptic zone by following us on twitter 720 00:32:40,830 --> 00:32:37,330 at skeptic zone liking us on facebook 721 00:32:42,330 --> 00:32:40,840 and leaving a review on iTunes you can 722 00:32:46,169 --> 00:32:42,340 also show your support by subscribing 723 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:46,179 via paypal for as little as 99 cents a 724 00:32:50,850 --> 00:32:49,210 week the skeptic zone is an independent 725 00:32:53,310 --> 00:32:50,860 production the views and opinions 726 00:32:54,900 --> 00:32:53,320 expressed on the skeptic zone are not 727 00:32:57,780 --> 00:32:54,910 necessarily those of Australian